Mr Manoj Kumar, EC is just supposed to hold election and not rule a state forever so hold your excitement. I am wondering what will happen if Laluji is not wiped out even after such a fair election. Don’t answer, people know your response. Laluji has made one thing sure, he convinced the masses you are human being and nobody should ever dare to generalise you as pigs.

Now life is never going to remain same. Game starts from here. - Vipin Singh, Patna - Oct. 28, 2005

I think we all agree with Mr. Manoj Kumar's observation about Mr. Raghu Yadav's comments on Election commission's role in the part two 2005 assembly elections.

When rigging and ballot looting took place for 15 years then election commission was good because it did not do its role. Now when it's doing its role and punishing the people who made mockery of democracy, few people are saying election commission is doing excesses and crossing its lines.

Unless someone takes the step and cleans the political garbage in Bihar and people who think their guns can win ballots as it was for last 15 years, nothing will change. If citizens cant do anything, then let this new avatar election commission hold free and fair elections. No Doubt casualty and innocent people are also being killed and affected in this election battle, which are human errors of the police personnel, which is unplanned and unfortunate too.

Let's hope Bihar gets clean election this time and un-biased leaders get elected and state of Bihar develops and all the caste and religion feel Bihar is for them. Time to end issues like casteism, and religion, development and welfare should be only agenda for BIHAR and BIHARIS, and jails, batons and tough legal sanctions for their past deed for criminals who made Bihar such poor so they don't dare to repeat and no such people ever dream of holding any position in Bihar.

Thanks and sorry if anyone feels hurt with my words. - Ashutosh, UK - Oct. 28, 2005

Dear Mr. Vipin Singh, when a player loses the game he blames the umpire; in this case the election commission. I am sure you would convey this to respected Laluji when you meet him over the tea break. Your words express you, for sure, seem to enjoy the hospitality at 1 Anne Besant Marg; rest of Bihar has felt ignored, downgraded and pushed behind in terms of development.

Time for you and the readers to vote and defend anyone who is for improvement of state and say good bye to old system and rise above narrow issues of personal favours, casteism, religious and family politics. I don't defend or derogate any particular leader or institution, I want a realisation in the minds of Biharis to end all evils and march towards a prosperous future. with due respect and apologies. - Capt. Ravi Sharma, New Delhi - Oct. 28, 2005

Best way for Bihar and Biharis to feel proud is to allow BJP win by 100 percent else Adwanis, Jetleys and Modis of today with their elite media will continue telling Biharis to feel ashamed of the fact that they are Biharis. Ladies and gentleman, fasten your seat belts, Adwanis, Jetleys and Modis of tomorrow have opened their card, you Bihari either give us vote or your Bihar is equivalent to J & K and you Biharis are anti national like…..there is no end to this. - Vipin Singh, Patna - Oct. 28, 2005

I completely agree with Manoj and Ashutosh. What election commission is doing should have been done by the Chief Minister of Bihar or by Governor. We have seen how things work in Bihar and have seen how administration is used by politicians.

To answer Mr. Vipin Singh's question, what will happen if Laluji is not wiped out even after such a fair election? I would say that it will be very UNFORTUNATE!

We haven't seen any political party come forward against all the atrocities that have been happening in Bihar for past few decades. Now that election commission is trying to do its duty for first time to hold fair election in Bihar, which was completely unheard of in decades, various political parties are coming forward with various different type of criticism in the name of "saving the democracy". Now we hear all these hypocrites like Yechuris, Rais, Prasads and Yadavs crying out loud "foul play". Where were these so called "savers of democracy" when the assembly was dissolved on some flimsy grounds and in most dramatic manner that India has ever witnessed? The comments being passed are not even laughable – not sure how to react to those comments.

Mr. Tiwari has made it his sole motto of his life to criticize Election Commission. He can cry as loud as he feels like, I don’t think anybody is listening or even wants to listen.

I was REALLY puzzled by comments from people in Raghopur, Rabri Devi’s constituency. According to them they will still vote for Rabri, even she has not done anything for them or will not do anything in future, just because she represents the same caste. Bihar will never come out of this problem (caste and religion issue) as long as illiteracy is there. How would you argue with these people?

I am not sure if things will take a U turn when NDA wins and forms the government. I am pretty sure, however, that they will be better than the previous government of Rabri Devi and the Governor’s rule. - Roshan Kumar - Oct. 28, 2005

The problem with people like Vipin Singh is that anytime someone talks about development, they turn it into a caste and religious war. They have to because that's the only thing they know how to talk about. - Manoj Kumar - Oct. 28, 2005

Dear Mr Vipin Singh

What happened to India after Mahatma Gandhi or to USA after Kennedy? In your eyes if Bihar has no future without Rabri, Lalu, and Sadhu, you are greatly mistaken. We are discussing the role of Election Commission and the state of sorry affairs in Bihar by the previous government. No personal views. So don't bias your views and as Capt. Sharma wrote, when players lose games, they blame game umpires. - Ashish Malhotra, Patna - Oct. 29, 2005

Mr Vipin Singh,

With due respect, it is not Advanis, Jaitleys and Modis saying that. It is rather, to your surprise, our own Biharis saying that except you. Not sure if you have ever talked to a mother whose child was abducted, not sure if you were ever there when people were being looted at gun point, not sure if you ever talked to somebody who has not received his/her salary for months, not sure if you talked to people who had lost their relatives in elections in past.

Where do you live Mr Singh? I am wondering. I have been through most of the atrocities listed above. My brother, a real hard worker, is a doctor and has never received his salary in time. It is always after months and that too not before he goes and camps in secretariat overnight for few nights. Who is responsible? Have you ever come out of Bihar and seen the development being done outside of Bihar?

Why am I writing all these? When an individual living in all these mess does not understand then who am I to make him/her understand?

Vote for Lalu and let it become worse then Kashmir. Kashmir is being looted and bombed by outsider. Bihar is being looted and bombed by none other than our own Biharis. I hope you see the difference!

Just make sure your children don't go out of Bihar for better education or for job. -Roshan Kumar - Oct. 29, 2005

Roshan Ji, please don’t wonder. In Patna I see teachers who hardly attend school; fighting for his salary and Doctors who never attend hospitals fighting for his salary and all of them blame Laluji for lack of health and education in Bihar. Biharis living in Bihar know that they have to bribe even for submitting their telephone bill and the guy who takes bribe, his son gives lecture against corruption from America. Yes, here on PatnaDaily, I may be alone expressing such views but come to Patna, I will help you meet many and many sharing my views. - Vipin Singh, Patna - Oct. 29, 2005

Vipin Singh Ji, I agree with your first comment life is never going to remain same, but I don’t agree with your second comment. BJP and Congress are deteriorating. They have lost UP and Bihar forever. As usual leaders from UP still think that they have the potential to become Prime Minister on their own so they are not allowing BJP or Congress to piggyback them in UP. In Bihar, RJD and LJP are carrying Congress in turns and JD(U) is carrying BJP. Mulayam Singh Yadav and Mayawati are the only leaders of UP and Lalu Prasad Yadav, Nitish Kumar and Ram Vilas Paswan are the only leaders of Bihar. In MP too, if frustration of Uma Bharti is any indication, situation are surely heading towards same direction. When it was Congress then it was BJP but if it will be only Uma Bharti then it has to be someone of her own category. UP, Bihar and MP forms the heartland of Aryawart. Those who will try to discredit heartland will find themselves discredited as it is happening with BJP and Congress. I think that this process of empowerment of deprived class had been quick and brutal but it will go beyond politics and will start working on social and economic development of the deprived. If we go by history books “Sudras” from this heartland of Aryawart have raised many great empires. History repeats, it may not repeat in the same way but it does repeat. I am sure down the years after the current process of empowerment we will again see someone from this class leading India to become a real superpower but who? Chanakya’s Chandragupta is yet not born? Who knows? I think it is too early to answer these questions but present Nandas have prepared the foundation. As for EC, I have no comment. They are immaterial in the bigger picture. - Dhananjay Bharadwaj, Patna - Oct. 29, 2005

This is in response to Mr Vipin's statement.

Like Mr. Raghu Yadav's comment, in a democracy, it is important to keep a check on every system whatever it is, even if that happens to be EC and it is good to learn that right thinking people are undertaking that role well. I am assuming that should disaffected party come into power, effort will be made to teach these EC officials a lesson for their highhandedness and so they should be. At least the life of a person is not being trivialised by saying that these are "ghatanas" and that these are only collateral damage for trying to hold free elections in Bihar (in case people forget - it is hard to forget casual remarks made by the erstwhile CM after double murders in a Patna train that these are "ghatanas" and that nothing can be done to avoid such happenings!!!). Well at least, the government can reassure, anyway, these things don't really matter, does it? Public memory is too short anyway.

No one really cares in the end who is there so long as they work - by work means working actually - you know things like clean water, proper healthcare, relatively secure environment etc....etc... in case one has forgotten what work means for the government - it has been a longtime and it is only understandable if one forgets . True that a great job has been done by instilling a sense of pride and making sure that human beings are treated like humans and not like pigs but it would also be right to say that that every effort has been taken to make everyone feel like "pigs" - so true social justice has been achieved in that sense- everyone barring a few with access to powers that be feel like pigs and when they feel they will be treated like one as well, leave the state. Any comment on the fact that Biharis (of all classes) have flooded cities like Mumbai, Delhi, Punjab, UK, US and are doing so well and the whole state has been turned into a pigsty anyway? With such huge mandate which would have allowed the lords and masters to do wonders for the State for everyone and with some help from well meaning supporters, would have found a place in history for social engineering. Alas, all that has been wasted for what? Not sure. Perhaps for becoming the same oppressor that he/she/they sought to fight. - Padmaja - Oct. 29, 2005

This is in response to Mr Vipin's comment.

You think you live in Patna so you know better - WRONG! I grew up in Patna and studied at Patna. 98% of my relatives are still in Bihar. I just visited Patna a couple of months ago. Don't tell me about those spineless doctors and teachers who don't want to perform their duty. I am talking about people who "actually" do their duty. Why are they being penalized? According to you whatever is happening in Bihar is right just because it was happening before Lalu and it will keep happening after Lalu. WRONG. I am not blaming Lalu, per say, but am blaming the system and your respected Laluji did very little to correct that. Please don't give me examples of those corrupt officials - they don't count. We allow them to be corrupt by agreeing to bribe them - because somewhere we are also responsible in corrupting the system. We don't want to stand in line we want to get things done easily and that is why bribe. We are always looking for easy way out.

I do not want to meet those people who you are referring to. I have seen that happening before but things have deteriorated to a large extent! I hope everybody agrees to that. If not then, can anybody tell me what happened to the glory of Patna University, prestigious Science College? Why there are no good roads available in Bihar? Why there are no industries left in Bihar? Don't even try to tell me that 15 years was not enough time to open good institutes, repair roads, open new industries, create jobs etc. Compare Bihar to other states in past 15 years and you will know.

Do you feel safe to send you daughter, sister, mother to market after 8PM in Patna? If not, why so? I don't remember this was the case 10 years back. We used to go out during Holi till midnight. What happened? Why don't we feel safe anymore?

I am not saying Delhi or Mumbai is better, why do I care if they are not. I care for Bihar first then any other place. As an Indian, however, I do care. If I am given an opportunity to pick between Delhi and Pune I would choose Pune, why? I guess the reasons are quite obvious for those who can distinguish or want to see the difference.

No further comments except that if you who are living in Patna don't see a problem then who am I to tell you otherwise. Most of the intelligent people go outside of Bihar and if trend continues then in no time Bihar will be left with all uneducated people ONLY. - Roshan Kumar - Oct. 30, 2005

Roshan Ji, it is not that people living in Bihar are not ready to listen to their own Son but problem starts occurring when they are willing to declare their 98% of relatives in Bihar uneducated. There is problem with the system and I don’t disagree with you but your arrogance away from Bihar is definitely not the solution of the problem. Bihar needs development but it can not start without reconciliation, till then you can silent few like me but even you know it has not helped your cause for last 15 years accept frustration and utter frustration. This attitude will not help you score a winning goal but a self defeating, self goal. Bihar needs your affection and I am sorry if I have disappointed you. - Vipin Singh, Patna - Oct. 30, 2005

Leadership, Mr. Vipin, what was the leadership doing all these years when the doctors and teachers were not attending schools and hospitals - isn't it the duty of leadership to take some steps to fix these things - they are being elected to do what - to make a mockery of the state ? And what does one say to the fact the leaders themselves have done nothing - they are not supposed to work or what? That is only for doctors and teachers? And when these good for nothing leaders visit god forsaken places, they use helicopters and five hundred cars follow them - what a waste of public money and you expect doctors to go and work in god forsaken places which has no amenities most of all security- why have the leaders not created a climate where these people go and work - they have been so successful to making the arms available to everyone - you know like they say in Patna "uske pas saman tha". Did'nt quite realise till late that saman means arms!!

As the art of living guru Sri Sri Ravishankar says (a course attended by the duo as well) accept the situation first - there is a problem in Bihar and no one can deny that. Start from there - is'nt it disgusting that even after so many years we see leaders being surrounded by pathetic looking people! And don't give that nonsense about US and UK - should'nt one be proud that even being away, people have such dedication for their place of origin and follow every move of what is happening. Should'nt one feel proud about this? No one is doubting the excellence of the leadership there but which has gone for a six - and yes - don't get personal - talk about issues - you know things that could be done to improve the state - have'nt seen that being mentioned by the esteemed leaders even once - the same talk about communal forces - can that be expanded a bit more to include the term - development? - Manoj Jha - Oct. 30, 2005

I think Raghu Yadav's article still has some kind of balance in its view. Some of the respondents have been a bit harsh on him. I think the real threat to the sate is from people like Mr. Vipin Singh. He belongs to the breed created by Laloo. The characteristics of the breed are

1. Zero tolerance to any criticism against Laloo irrespective of its validity.
2. Absolute lack of reason when presenting a view point because the only reason they know is rotting, stinking call for social justice.
3. Selective blindness to damages done to the state in the past 15 years.
4. Heightened awareness of their rights, which of course, includes right to verbal and physical abuse of people who dare criticising their leader and for that matter just happen to belong to certain caste or belief.
5. Blighted sense of duty. For most of them 'might is right' which is a direct result of protection provided to them by their masters they serve.

I hope that the wheel of social cycle moves a bit faster and the people of the state (the so called oppressed and down-trodden) realise the sinister game plan of the handful of unscrupulous politicians exploiting them in the name of social justice. - R Parmeshwar - Oct. 30, 2005

I am not trying to be personal but am debating on the fact that there are still good people available in Bihar and that is the ONLY reason why Bihar is surviving. There is a limit to everything and people will soon give up and would soon start looking for alternative. I am not calling my 98% relatives uneducated. You are missing the point completely!

People have said enough in this debate and at this point I don't think we will get anything out of this debate. To enlighten you there are few facts I would like to present for your benefit. There are several Non resident Bihrais trying to do a lot for Bihar. Lots of them are sending money to NGOs in Bihar. Please go and check these NGOs and see what is happening to the money being sent from people who love their Bihar. Please visit biharbrains.org and see what people are trying to do. Why can't people like you help these organizations instead of defending all these jokers (politicians). I can send you more website for your reference if you are interested. All these people are looking for local people for help.

Let's act now and stop these debates. Debates are good and healthy but to a certain extent only, let's not stretch it. Let's work together to make Bihar a number 1 place in India in all respect. I know we can do it! Roshan Kumar - Oct. 31, 2005

Click here to send comment on this topic

By sending comments to PatnaDaily.Com, you agree to the conditions listed here.